Hello,

I was wondering is it only worth fitting the spirit elfstones with characters who have the spirit skills ie idrial hadhod elegost and eoden?

Or is it worth fitting to to berethor aswell as this would enhance his leadership skills effectiveness?

also if you fitted it with morwen would it enhance her spirit skills like steel health?

quote Tazza20

Hello,

I was wondering is it only worth fitting the spirit elfstones with characters who have the spirit skills ie idrial hadhod elegost and eoden?

Or is it worth fitting to to berethor aswell as this would enhance his leadership skills effectiveness?

also if you fitted it with morwen would it enhance her spirit skills like steel health?

The character needs to have some kind of spirit based attack in order for the stone to be of much use.

Bererthor has no spirit based attacks and Morwen wouldn't benefit either I think.

Berethor and Moren would only benefit if you have first had them learn the Shadowcraft Skills or the Lightcraft Skills as those skill sets do have a spirit attack.

I do recommend that you have all the characters learn the Shadowcraft Skills as they are very useful and powerful and I do recommend that you all the characters except for Idrial learn the Lightcraft Skills as they are very useful as well.

As for which characters are worth fitting with the spirit elfstone, Idrial is the first one that should get it. If you fit her with the Ancient Spirit Elfstone it will make a tremendous difference in the power of her water attack. Hadhod would benefit when he used his fire attacks and Eaoden would benefit I would think. Elegost wouldn't benefit very much though as most of his attacks are not spirit attacks.

But, Morwen has a 'Steal Health' ability which is simular to Eoden's Drain health skill. When you put the Spirit Elfstone with Eoden, it increases the amount of health he can drain. So surely, fitting it with Morwen, there would be a noticeable increase with her aswell?

I've never equipped or learned any of the elfstone skills before. This is because with all my characters except for idrial I have the Ancient Elfstone of armour, health and action ehancement. And the 4th elfstone I have equipped with every character is the Ancient elfstone of spirit enhancement. Though, with Berethor and Morwen, I think I have the Polished elfestone of blunt defense. I'd just prefere to have very high health and defense, rather than spending hours learning extra skills. Do I make sense?

quote Tazza20

But, Morwen has a 'Steal Health' ability which is simular to Eoden's Drain health skill. When you put the Spirit Elfstone with Eoden, it increases the amount of health he can drain. So surely, fitting it with Morwen, there would be a noticeable increase with her aswell?

I've never equipped or learned any of the elfstone skills before. This is because with all my characters except for idrial I have the Ancient Elfstone of armour, health and action ehancement. And the 4th elfstone I have equipped with every character is the Ancient elfstone of spirit enhancement. Though, with Berethor and Morwen, I think I have the Polished elfestone of blunt defense. I'd just prefere to have very high health and defense, rather than spending hours learning extra skills. Do I make sense?

I think you may be right about Morwen's Steal Health being more effective if she has the Ancient Elfstone of Spirit Enhancement equipped, I never thought to check on this myself, so I don't really know.

However on the Elfstone Skills, once a character has learned all of the Shadow skills they no longer need to have the stone equipped, likewise if a character has learned all of the Light skills they no longer need the stone and also if a character learns the Nimblecrafting skills they no longer need that stone either.

To me it is well worth spending some time training the characters so that all of them learn the Shadow skills and so that most of them learn the Light skills, and I also have a couple characters learn Nimblecrafting---Elegost and Morwen on the Nimblecrafting.

Check out the skill tree on the Shadow skills and the skill tree on the Light skills, there are some really good skills to have in them.

Also with Nimblecrafting you don't need to worry about not having enough potions, you will be able to make most of them with Nimblecrafting.

I see. Would it not make sence to equip the craft item, lightcraft and shadowcraft elfstone to Idriel, then, when you have learned them all, you could replace them with the cracked, Polished and Ancient elfstone of spirit enhancement... that way you would have on mega spirit wielder? And for your 4th elfstone maybe you could have Anient Health enhancement? And since Idrial has very high spirit stats anyway, surely she'd be best for the job?

And can you do double attack with any of the skill elfstones?

quote Tazza20

I see. Would it not make sence to equip the craft item, lightcraft and shadowcraft elfstone to Idriel, then, when you have learned them all, you could replace them with the cracked, Polished and Ancient elfstone of spirit enhancement... that way you would have on mega spirit wielder? And for your 4th elfstone maybe you could have Anient Health enhancement? And since Idrial has very high spirit stats anyway, surely she'd be best for the job?

And can you do double attack with any of the skill elfstones?

Well this is what I do.

I train Berethor in Shadowcraft and Lightcraft as well as his Leadership and Sword Skills.

I train Idrial in Shadowcraft as well as her Sword and Spirit Skills. I don't bother to train her in Lightcraft since most of them are redundant and she doesn't need them.

I train Elegost in Shadowcraft, Lightcraft and Nimblecrafting as well as his Bow and Ranger Skills.

I train Hadhod in Shadowcraft and Lightcraft as well as his Axe and Spirit Skills.

I train Morewen in Shadowcraft, Lightcraft and Nimblecrafting as well as her Dual Axe and Spirit Skills.

I train Eaoden in Shadowcraft and Lightcraft as well as his Spear and Spirit Skills.

I train all characters to the point that before they get to Pelennor Fields they have learned every skill that I have set them to learn.

Eaoden is the last character to learn every skill as his Spear Skills take me longer to train him in.

Note: Idrial and Eaoden both have Frenzy and when they use Frenzy they can do actions taken from the Spirit, Shadowcraft or Lightcraft skill sets.

When Berethor does a double attack I don't recall if he can do anything but a sword attack, I do recall that Elegost and Morwen can only do a weapon attack if they use Double Attack.

Thanks!

I'm guessing that the best way to learn skills is to fire Elegost Sleep Volly, and then use your characters to do their skills over and over again? How many hours gameplay did you have to learn all of that you listed? As it took me 30 hours to complete the game normally (when I did hardly any travelling), I just went straight through and had only learned all skills with Elegost by the end.

quote Tazza20

Thanks!

I'm guessing that the best way to learn skills is to fire Elegost Sleep Volly, and then use your characters to do their skills over and over again? How many hours gameplay did you have to learn all of that you listed? As it took me 30 hours to complete the game normally (when I did hardly any travelling), I just went straight through and had only learned all skills with Elegost by the end.

Ok I haven't been playing for a little while, but I loaded the game and did some checking.

At this point I am in Minas Tirith and I have completed 87% of the chapter and I have spent 74 hours and 53 minutes on the game so far. Also I am on Hard difficulty.

Idrial and Eaoden both have an Ancient Elfstone of Spirit Enhancement. Since yes it does help Eaoden greatly as it does help Idrail greatly, I gave one to both of them.

I didn't train Idrial and Eaoden in Lightcraft, just in Shadowcraft. Everyone else is trained in Lightcraft and Shadowcraft. Morwen and Elegost are also trained in Nimblecrafting.

Everyone has learned all of their skills including the passive ones except for Eaoden who has learned Frenzy and is halfway to the next one.

Party Levels: Idrial 68, Hadhod 69, Elegost 69, Berethor 70, Morwen 71, and Eaoden 71.

This isn't something that I thought of, but when you are in Moria facing the Goblin Drummer you keep the battle going as long as you wish and train Idrial, Berethor, Hadhod and Elegost while getting them a lot of experience in the process.

For futher training, start when you get the Shadow stone from the Balrog. Give the stone to Idrial, Hadhod, Elegost, or Berethor. I would give the stone to Elegost, or Berethor myself.

To start with use the crippling attack that Hadhod has as well as make sure to have Idrial get her Stun strike, as well as the crippling attack that Elegost has as well as his Sleep.

Travel back to the begining and work on learning Shadowcraft and once you have Shadowcraft: Crippling use it to slow the enemy so that they are unable to attack you.

Use Crippling over and over until you can do Fear and then use Fear while you train the other characters in the party at the same time.

Once a character with the Shadowstone has learned Wheel of Fire have another character equip the stone and start learning the Shadow Skills.

You do want to move on the game after a bit so that you can go get Morwen and then go back to the beginning again so that you can work on training Morwen. Morwen needs some work, but she is very useful if you put some effort into her.

Do much the same when you get the Lightstone later in the game and when you get the Nimblecrafting stone if I were you I would give it to Elegost first and then later give it to Morwen.

Also make sure to keep working on leveling up Morwen by using her Steal Experience skill once she has learned everything.

I hope that this makes sense,if you need some clarification just ask.

I see, thanks very much for your advice so far

But the spirit elfstones will be more effective fitted with someone who has very high spirit stats (Idrial) for example? Or you could just do what you've done and fit them with practically everyone.

I have completed the game a few times till now. Only started playing it again recently though. So you'd recommend when getting the elfstone off the Balrog going travelling back and learning all the skills, I suppose I'd fit it with Idrial as I could do double attack and learn them twice as quick.

One thing I have thought of, is that for example, when Berethor gets paralysis of light from Sauron (which prevents you from using spirit skills) he can't use nearly all of his leadership skills meaning that they are spirit skills. So, if you fitted the spirit enhancement elfstone with Berethor, it would surely enhance his leadership skills? Though this is just my theory, need to try it!

quote Tazza20

I see, thanks very much for your advice so far

But the spirit elfstones will be more effective fitted with someone who has very high spirit stats (Idrial) for example? Or you could just do what you've done and fit them with practically everyone.

I have completed the game a few times till now. Only started playing it again recently though. So you'd recommend when getting the elfstone off the Balrog going travelling back and learning all the skills, I suppose I'd fit it with Idrial as I could do double attack and learn them twice as quick.

One thing I have thought of, is that for example, when Berethor gets paralysis of light from Sauron (which prevents you from using spirit skills) he can't use nearly all of his leadership skills meaning that they are spirit skills. So, if you fitted the spirit enhancement elfstone with Berethor, it would surely enhance his leadership skills? Though this is just my theory, need to try it!

I haven't fitted everyone with the Ancient Spirit Elfstones at this point, so I just know that when Idrial and Eaoden have one it makes a huge difference for those characters.

Next time I start from the beginning I am thinking that I may get more of them and see if they make much of a difference with Morwen, Hadhod, Berethor and Elegost, and then if they do I will make sure to get more of them in the future.

Idrial can't do Frenzy right away, so you can't train her spirit skills or her Shadow skill that fast right away.

Also I don't try to learn all of the skills when I travel back the one time to Eregion.

What I like to do is travel back to Eregion and then train some there until I get bored with that I then go back to Eastemnet and maybe work on that chapter a bit and then travel to Eastern Moria and then back to Eastemnet where I work on some on it until I get to another save point and then I travel to Western Moria and do some more training.

Note: My main objective is get which ever character I give the Shadow stone to, usually Berethor, trained to the point where they can use Fear as soon as possible. Once I can do Fear, training everyone is very easy as most enemies are not immune to Fear.

While I am training Berethor in Shadow Skills I also make a point to train Idrial in her Spirit Skills. and I switch Elegost and Hadhod in and out so that both of them get some training too.

When I am tired of training and I have made some progress by this time, I finish Eastemnet and then I go to Rohan and pick up Morwen and then I immediately travel back to Eregion where I do more training, especially working on Morwen.

Work on training everyone, but especially Morwen and then when you are tired of training, go back so that you can defeat Wormtongue in order to get the Light Stone, next travel back and start training characters with the Light stone, again I like to train Berethor with the Light stone first.



This message was edited by lordtyger9 on Mar 28 2009.

I follow you.

Next question... Yow know Morwen's steel skill ability. I understand that when you use it you get one skill point for thief craft and one for axe craft as well as a skill point for thief craft for using the skill. But apparently, with some enemies, you steel more than one skill point?

I know that the spirit elfstone make a big difference with Elegost True Shot and his Northern Storm, as they are both spirit based. Although it does lower AP and HP which is rather annoying. Is there a quick way to learning sword craft with characters like Idrial, Eoden and Hadhod, as I find that if you find a group of enemies and you start using your swordcraft, you can't make the battles go on for ages and practice over and over, since you have to use your swordcraft on the enemies, and it doesn't take long before you kill them all!?

quote Tazza20

I follow you.

Next question... Yow know Morwen's steel skill ability. I understand that when you use it you get one skill point for thief craft and one for axe craft as well as a skill point for thief craft for using the skill. But apparently, with some enemies, you steel more than one skill point?

I know that the spirit elfstone make a big difference with Elegost True Shot and his Northern Storm, as they are both spirit based. Although it does lower AP and HP which is rather annoying. Is there a quick way to learning sword craft with characters like Idrial, Eoden and Hadhod, as I find that if you find a group of enemies and you start using your swordcraft, you can't make the battles go on for ages and practice over and over, since you have to use your swordcraft on the enemies, and it doesn't take long before you kill them all!?

I make very frequent use of Morwen's Steal Skill ability, but I have never gotten more than one skill point from any enemy.

I have never had Morwen equipped with the Ancient Spirit Stone, so I don't know what difference it may make, but I suspect that it would not make a difference with this skill.

Some characters are a lot easier to train in their weapon skills than others.

Morwen is by far the easiest in this respect, since if you use Steal Skill it works on Dual Axe skills as well as working on her Spirit skills, also once Morwen has learned Cloak of the Plains, you can use Battle Haste which will work on her dual Axe skils without killing the enemy.

With Idrial you should have her first learn wounding and then stunning strike and then leach inspiration.

Once Idrial can do leach inspiration, just have her do it over and over until she has learned the rest of her sword skills.

With Elegost once he learns Kingsfoil Grace, you can have him do that when training him in his Ranger skills, otherwise you just have to have him use his skills a lot, so make sure to use him a lot as there really aren't any shortcuts to speak of really.

When training Berethor in his sword skills or Hadhod in his axe and hammer skills you just have to have them make use of these skills a lot, there are no shortcuts.

What you could do with Morwen to learn her skills quickly is leave just one orc left for example in a battle, use Elegost's paralysing shot, and have everyone else retreat from the battle other than Morwen. Then use the Steel Skill over and over again on that Orc, gaining loads of skill points?

What's your view on how to spend your stat points on characters? I read in another forum to obviously put strength and dexterity on your hard hitters, and cons. And then on your spirit wielders you'd dump all your points on Spirit. Though, what about speed? I've always had speed the lowest out of all my stats. How important is it and what difference does it make? I've noticed in the last levels of the game, enemies seem to be having many turns. Is this normal as it's the last part of the game, or should I be spending loads of my stat points on speed?

quote Tazza20

What you could do with Morwen to learn her skills quickly is leave just one orc left for example in a battle, use Elegost's paralysing shot, and have everyone else retreat from the battle other than Morwen. Then use the Steel Skill over and over again on that Orc, gaining loads of skill points?

This would work, however I would make a point to have two other characters stay there and work on something instead of everyone besides Morwen retreating. I figure that I shouldn't waste the opportunity to have the characters do something.

quote Tazza20

What's your view on how to spend your stat points on characters? I read in another forum to obviously put strength and dexterity on your hard hitters, and cons. And then on your spirit wielders you'd dump all your points on Spirit. Though, what about speed? I've always had speed the lowest out of all my stats. How important is it and what difference does it make? I've noticed in the last levels of the game, enemies seem to be having many turns. Is this normal as it's the last part of the game, or should I be spending loads of my stat points on speed?

The Speed of the character determines the number of actions that they get per a given time period.

These are the stats that I make sure to increase on each character, more or less in order of priority

Berethor...Dex,Spirit, Speed, Strength Con
Idrial....Spirit, Con, Speed plus some Dex
Hadhod...Dex,Spirit, Speed, Strength
Morwen...Spirit, Con, Speed, Dex
Elegost...Spirit,Speed Dex

Eaoden can be a heavy hitter or a spirit wielder.I use him as more a spirit wielder myself.

Eaoden as Spirit wielder:
Speed, Spirit Con

Eaoden as heavy hitter:
Strength, Dex Con

Right I see. So speed high speed allows you to act more often in combat? So Indrial's Hate of the Elves is like a big speed boost to a character?

Would Morwen's Steel Skill wake up a sleeping enemy. I'd imagine it would. Under Morwen's thief craft, she has several abilities such as Capture Strength, Seize Dexterity, Steel Experience, Steel Skill etc. How many of these are permanent? Is it just the Steel Skill and Experience that are permanent?