This game intrested me, until I saw recently the new spells being used. Bioware obviously loves mages, and no one else in their NwN games. The old game was overbalanced to that point, a mage was god, the end. In the new game it is even more so.

^ The above is using only items available in the single player game.

The fact is the items in the single player game give you very little that can be used to stop mages. Instead of just starting a mage character myself, I still play a rogue.

As a rogue it is unfair to have the spell True Seeing able to detect hidden thieves. Hiding for a rogue is more akin to camoflauge, it is not magical and should not be detectable by the spell.

A rogue has moderate magic, which is slow due to scroll casting. They have very weak attacks when it comes to physical. Pickpocket will get you banned from most online servers. So that leaves us with stealth, which is taken away by the single casting of a spell. Which brings me back to the point, if anything they need to reduce the abilities of the Mage class.

Your only hope in a battle against a mage is being skilled with a ranged weapon(Which usually means some kind of fighter character), and dropping them before they get up their enchantments, which are many.

Gotta agree with you there man, mages seem to be over-developed.
I am quite fond of the rogue class myself, but due to the drawbacks you mention, I had to multiclass as a fighter

The newest spells I have seen used are the more powerful versions of Bigby's Crushing Hand, which from what I saw are absolutely devastating. Not only do they hold you from moving, but also inflict massive damage. A mage using quickened spells would have plenty of time to get off a Power Word Kill, which if no one has noticed does not have a save, nor is it affected by magic resistance. You have to have a specific immunity, to effectively defend against it.


Mages wear so many enchantments, a sherman tank could not penetrate it firing shells of mordenkainen's dysjunction, and greater spell breach.

So does this mean you wont be getting it?

Of course I will be getting, I want to get those Assassin and Shadow Dancer abilities for my rogue, I am imagining a multiclass of the two will be a sneaky, and deadly bastard.

I thought you could only get one special class.....?

Might be the case, they do have limits on the number of ranks you can give them.

Actually Rogues always had a disadvantage against most of the classes, and that's unavoidable. Mostly every single spell and skill was from the 3rd edition book, (these include both mage and thieves). They obviously can't go against the grain by eliminiating the spell True Seeing because magic will always triumph as the greatest skills (because they compensate with less physical strength, naturally).

A high level mage is arguably the best class, but also the hardest class to raise to level 20 (what with low stats and horrid spells) in the beginning so there is compensation.

rogues are used for their skills... If you have played any fighter class or magic class with out the trap skills you would see how powerfull a rogue is... anyway you could allways buy high level scrolls & use them too balance yourself out against the mage class's.

Yup, of course,rogues being the sneaky lil bast*rds they are, can't compete with anything in pvp. Once they are part of a team though, they are probably the most valuable member. I always try to make my chars in a way that they would compliment other pcs, since i dont particularly like pvp much. I love rogues, and in a fight, if you can plan it well so the rogue can lay traps, then sneak a monster from behind, after its run over all your fiendish devices, then they can be absolutly devestating. Like you said though, true seeing does remove most of the rogues best abilities, so i personally would like to see something implemented in which rogues can hide from this.

quote TheyellowDart

rogues are used for their skills... If you have played any fighter class or magic class with out the trap skills you would see how powerfull a rogue is... anyway you could allways buy high level scrolls & use them too balance yourself out against the mage class's.

No that wouldnt work, unless you went into the editor and created higher caster level scrolls. The single player scrolls are set to the minimum level that spell needs, meaning that a rogues scroll will do the minimum effect of that spell, meanwhile the level 20 mage gets the bonuses to power because his spells are cast from level 20. ( Example, scroll of magic missle fires about two, to three magic missles. A level 20 mage casting the spell creates five magic missles. )

I enjoy PvP myself, as long as the person is using single player items, and not custom items they forged in the editor.

Also, just once I would like to find a group of people who are willing to roleplay through the original game. Not just get everything done as quickly as possible.

maybe we could team up then? I haven't gotten the internet thing figured out yet, but I'm sure I'll be looking for some people to play with that use legit items and characters. Do you like the original NwN or the SoU expansion more? I have those, and the HotU expansion.

These other guys are probably long gone now. If you want to discuss these games or ask for advice you should check out gamefaqs cause the messageboards there are still used by a lot of people.

plese help me installing the SoU...I installed the SHADOWS OF UNDERTIDE competely,then when I start playing the game it asked me the CD key,I typed the CD key like a good boy and it asked me again,i typed over and over again but nothing happens. . .PLEESE HELP!!!!!!!!!!!

Are you still having this issue? I have a couple of keys.